Well Tess definitely bit someone today....Paul was with her and he saw it. the woman trod on her whilst trying to get to another dog and she bit her ankle. NO blood I think but bruising.

Paul apologised but got quite annoyed when the woman said she should be put down, and was a danger to children etc. She also denied treading on her.

Anyway the woman took our address and I think she will report it so fingers crossed they won't say we have to go to court or put her to sleep. I'm quite worried now so will have to wait and see if we get a visit. Luckily there was another persn there who knows Tess and said that she is a lovely dog usually.

We have had a talk because I think Paul was thinking at first that we might have to have her put to sleep. After talking to friends we have decided that this is not necessary as she has never shown any aggression to us or our family and friends when at home.

SO this morning I put the muzzle on her and my poor baby looks like Hannibal the Cannibal. She also manages to get it off so need to work on that. Just concerned now that she gets enough exercise as am only going to be able to let her off where I can see there is no one around.

Sorry for the long post but this is a huge thing for me. It makes me very sad and angry as she is such a loving dog with us and no one can believe she would be like this. I am angry that something must have happened to make her like this whether it is lack of socialisation or something worse.

What a nightmare!!

Sorry to hear this has happened Leanne - did you ever find a behaviourist to help with Tess???

I know using a muzzle is horrible but if it gives you peace of mind and keeps Tess from bitting anyone else then better safe than sorry.

Morning Leanne - Im so sorry to hear your news. I know the muzzle isnt what you or Paul want to use but at least you know that Tess will be safe with it on for the time being.
Im keeping my fingers crossed that she doesnt report you, but if she does at least you can tell them that you take Tess training, agility etc - this must go in your favor, i know what Tess done was wrong but surly they have to take into account that you do lots of training with her.
Im so sorry Leanne - Thinking of you all

Jo
x

Hi leanne,
I am so sorry and feel for you after all you have been through with Tess. I agree
with the others, this was an exceptional circumstance, if someone trod on me I would lash out too. I think the fact that no blood was drawn it sounds more like a warning nip than a deliberate bite. I am sure if that is mentioned and as said by others, all the things you do with Tess will count in her favour. Hopefully it wont come to that.

As for the muzzle, dont let it worry you and Paul. If you feel it will help then put it on Tess. If you are more relaxed when out she will be also. If you dont muzzle her and are always wary and cautious and call her back everytime you see someone/thing she may learn to react. Which could be anything from just failing her recall to being protective.

I think the biggest problem you get when out with a muzzle is the looks from other people who just dont understand or assume before asking. I have met many dogs out and about with muzzles and the majority have all been friendly, ie. they come over for a fuss not stand and growl or bark at you in a threatening way. So not all are muzzled for the reasons we think.
I get them and my muzzle is on a Lab purely to stop her eating so much rubbish, poo and un-nice things. Im sure she thinks her name is leave-it. rolleyes*

Thanks everyone for your kind words and support.

I do feel as if this is my fault and I should have reacted better to the warning signs.

I'm not bothered what people think about the muzzle to be honest - I am doing it for their sake as well as hers. My concern is that if she can keep getting it off I won't be able to let her run free and she does love running.

SHould I just make it tighter or try a different type? it is a plastic basket muzzle

I would go to a good pet shop and try a few different ones on Leanne you and tess both have to be happy with it - Yeas ago you used to be able to get one which was like a sleeve that went over their nose and attached at the back a little like a head halti.

I have emailed you direct

oh no, how awful for you all.

i expect the lady took your details as she sounds like a stoppy arse, you never know what to expect.

IF you should have a visit etc, they will more than likely want to meet her, keep your cool is my best advice, if you or paul get funny about it , it will make you look like the bad guys, which wwe know you arent, so stay calm and try and explain what happened from your point of view,

alot of dogs first reaction to pain is to bite, why do they think you are told to makeshift-muzzle and injured dog! but scarily for you it could be a kid or older frail person next time, so better to be safe than sorry and i think i would agree to muzzle her when out and about.

most dogs get used to muzzles pretty quickly, claires kai uses one on a group walk as he can be funny about toys being his, so he wears one on group walks, no big deal for him, he still loves his walks, and hasnt had a fight at all.

stay calm, think positive even tho its hard! remember you are doing your best for her benefit, with all the training etc you do and being a rescue, she needs time to get used to it all, she is still really new to you guys and finding her feet.

a basket muzzle is probably better, i have one of the mikki types, and tbh meg can still pull the collapsible cage down onto herself with her mouth with it on....so suggests she could still give a nip if she felt so inclined, but see what you can find to try out

this just sounds like a really unlucky accident *doggiehug*

If the police visit, they might send two officers. Often they'll send one who is experienced around dogs and is a handler or something and he'll want to meet the dog to assess it and the other will take a statement from you.

One of my previous dogs snapped at a toddler when his stupid dippy mother let him run over and he grabbed her head on either side and thrust his face right up to hers to cuddle her. Unfortunately, she was a dog and not a stuffed toy and so she reacted. The stupid dippy mother had the same attitude as this woman Tess has nipped.
She reported me and it took about three weeks before police decided to turn up to what had been reported as a "Dog attack". You could tell the pair of them thought it was a complete waste of time and the dog handling one came back inside after meeting the dogs and told me not to worry about it. both the dogs had been fine with him. It was the younger one that snapped and she was 12.5 years old and that was the first time. She was also on a lead so they couldn't even do me for having a dog out of control in a public place. I was cautioned and that was it. The stupid dippy mother tried to make me muzzle mine but I told her to get stuffed and keep her kids under control and there was nothing she could do about it.
If Tess was off lead, they could try and get that on you but they'd need proof that she had shown aggressive tendancies previously and was deemed a dangerous dog before they could order her to be PTS.
The woman can deny standing on her but Paul can also insist she did stand on her. Not intentionally but dogs don't know that do they? Her word against his...
I find though with some dogs when they are sniffing another and the other dogs owner comes and stoops over to get their dog and put it on lead that this can be a risky situation for dogs that can bite as a reaction to being nervous. Try to avoid that situation with Tess at ALL costs. It can make your dog feel like the owner of the other dog has come along to back their dog up and see your dog off. Can make them defensive.

Thanks everyone for your support. i have spoken to Paul about staying calm no matter what they say she said.

I can fully understand that she as shocked and worried as she had children with her. HOwever Paul and the othr woman who was there both say that she did go on and on and Paul said she was getting very stroppy / aggressive.

I am thinking of taking her out of obedience classes after this as she does get wound up and I think it might be best to train her at home or outside on lead. Not sure really. I will keep up the agility as it will give her the chance to run and chase her ball etc and it is a one to one.

Maybe in time I will be able to introduce her to classes again - we'll have to wait and see

I know someone whose dog has bitten strangers twice and been reported, and they had marks to prove it. The police saw her both times and just gave her warnings.

I would have thought as there weren't any witnesses then there isn't much they can do about it, especially if she stood on Tess! So don't worry too much.

John stepped on nellie the other week & she bit him, cant blame them. Fingers xdfor tess, wot a nightmare

Thanks. There was a witness and she took her address as well. But luckily the witness knows us quite well and did stand up for Tess so fingers crossed

It's worrying I know, I'm having probs with Roxy, she shows aggression to others, she has even snapped at and nipped a friend of mine, Roxy is nervous and hasn't in my opinion had any socialisation so does not know how to act with strangers, but she has changed with one of my neighbours and is a normal fussy puppy with him so i know it can happen, just takes time.

Also some people like to make mountains out of molehills.

this is all upsetting for u hun im sure but try not to worry, we know how tess she wudnt do it as a vious attack!!
i hope u get it sorted!
lou x

The person who trod on Tess should surely be able to accept that it was not as if Tess raced across a field and attacked - IF you see the Police they should understand that too ....

I AM SORRY FOR YOUR TROUBLE LEANNE,
i had a slight problem not unlike yours couple of years ago with lexie, when tara was a puppy we were out on the line walking, lexie off lead tara on it ( she was 9 weeks old) a man with a buggy came walking and i called lexie to me and she sat good as gold next to me, but the man decided to stop and talk to the cute puppy, tara was scared and gave a little wimper and lexie shot around the back of me and nipped the bloke right in the arse, she made a little hole in his shorts and there was slight red mark from her teeth, the man was not happy, i was very upset about it and the man took my address and screamed nasty thing about shooting lexie,
lexie is not a nasty dog but she thopught he was going to hurt tara, she has never dont it again but i do watch her when men are about.
the man was all hot air and nothing ever came of it.

i hope you have the same luck , poor tess she wouldnt have ment to hurt ther woman she was upset cos she was stood on

Fingers crossed that you are all right! We can't believe it because she is so loving and soft with us and visitors to our house. SHe has never shown any sign of aggression towards us.

Anway - I have been a bit concerned as to the best way forward. I always think that training is a good idea but have received lots of conflicting suggestions.

Our vetinary nurse had mentioned a behaviourist over in Peterborough before and said that they are veryr good. An initial consultation is £150 though and after the disaster last time I wasn't sure.

Anyway I phoned them because they also do cheaper one to one training sessions so I wanted to ask if I would need the behavioural one and if I needed to go through my vets.

Had a long chat with the woman and she is coming out next week in the early evening for the price of a training session and will go from there. Then if I think it's useful I can go for the whole behavioural assessment. Was really pleased with this as although it will cost me £60 (!!!) for an hour and a half it is less than half the price of an assessment. And she will come to our home where Tess is a lot more relaxed

Fingers crossed

That sounds positiove Leanne, and like you say Tess wil much better in her own home. I hope it goes well, have my fingers crossed for you x

Well the behaviourist was very nice and helpful and has given us some tips. Tess seems to be worse lately but I am hoping that in time and when she gets used to the muzzle she will calm down.

I have decided to stop taking her to training classes as she gets stressed in them and after seeing how she can turn I don't feel comfortable with it.

I took her today to a class outside and she was very good until someone was making friends with her (a person) and she suddenly turned. Lots of barking , lunging and snarling - the worst I have seen. it was horrible and for the first time I felt a bit scared.

So for the moment I am working on keeping her calm, training her at home and we'll go from there. I feel so angry / upset that something has made her like this as she has so much potential and can be an absolute darling. I also feel like i'm in way over my head!! I could cope with aggression to other dogs but not people!!

Oh no i hope that this training you are doing at home with her will help. I'm hope she gets better as time goes on as she sounds like such a lovely dog.

All the best to you and Tess

*doggiehug*

I could cope with aggression to other dogs but not people!!

Leanne - You and Paul have done so much to help her, you are so good for her she will come round in time im sure and if she always has to wear a muzzle, well if she were mine I would rather that than not have her at all. I know you must be upset and disapointed but you really should give yourself a break!! - You have given her a loving home, you do training and agilty - shes got a fantastic life now and thats all down to you.

She loves her training so I would carry on at home like you said and see how things go. Keep your options open as you may want to take her back to classes one day - Keep your chin up mate xx Your doing fab with Tess xx

I never did get the hang of the 'quote' button - sorry lol
beersmilie

Hows Tess getting on now Leanne - Is all ok?

Jo

HI Jo thanks for asking...

Tess seems to be fine at the moment. I have taken her out of obedience classes but still do agility with her and occasionally flyball.

I have decided to giver her more time to settle and get her arousal levels down and get used to the muzzle etc and then I will look at training again

We still do training at home and there are tennis and basket ball courts nearby where I can take her muzzle off and throw her ball

She seems to cope better when she isn't being put in these situations so for the moment that's what I'll do. I think I found this hard as I'm a strong believer in training and trying to help the dog that way but for her this isn't appropriate at this time

Was really pleased because on our way home from our walk this morning a woman stopped to tell me what lovely dogs I have!!!

You sound more positive Leanne, your sounded so down and upset i was so worried about you - Im glad all is ok and i think your doing Fab with Tess, shes a lucky girl

Jo
x

Training is not important, it is more important to get your dog to be able to relax and to learn how to deal with situations. I have a collie and I would never ever take him to training classes as life is just so much like hard work for him. I would rather he learned to cope with day to day living than to put anymore stress on his little shoulders.

I have to say that my 8 have hardly ever done any formal training in class situations and they respect me and are so well repsected for their good behaviour.

Take it one day at a time and watch your little girl progress in a steady manner it is so worth it. waggingd